“Let your heart therefore be wholly true to the LORD our God,” said the wise King Solomon (1 Kings 8:60-61). But for our hearts to be wholly true to the one true God, we must know who He is:
Holy. Righteous. Good.
Members of the Mormon Church who accept the teachings of the first Mormon prophet Joseph Smith (and subsequent Mormon leaders) do not necessarily agree that these are fundamental, nonnegotiable attributes of God.
At a 2004 Ligonier Ministries conference, Christian pastor John MacArthur spoke on the true nature of God: His uniqueness, His righteousness, His holiness. In this 54 minute video Dr. MacArthur presents God as God has revealed Himself in the Bible.
May those who don’t know the one true God come to know and embrace Him as He really is. And may we all — forever — let our hearts be wholly true to God.
If only Mormons would listen to men like Mr MacArthur , they would know the truth about our Creator and be set free and thus exchange the false doctrine of Mormonism for the truth the Bible reveals . A lot is at stake , a life filled with doing good deeds cannot make up for believing in a God that is as non unique as the one Mormon leaders like Joseph Smith succumbed into believing in . There was a time when those who followed Smith believed in what he preached about God as the unique one true God —
Psalms 90:2 ; Moroni 7;22 , 8:18 ; Matt 28:19 ; 2Nephi 31:21 ; but unfortunately that did’nt last very long , a few years passed and Joseph Smith was lured by his feelings into error . He succumbed to apostasy by teaching Gods, and sinful man could become Gods . Men who Smith had mentored ,like Brigham Young , after his death continued drifting even further away from the truth and taught more about Gods even Goddesses . The Majestic Creator of heaven and earth that the Bible reveals had become a not so unique and Majestic God , He had been brought down to a creature : born to a higher God and Goddess in some distant world , he had to be taught how to become the Creator of this world as at one time He did’nt know how to even proclaim ” Let there be Light” ( Gen 1:3 ) .He is only one in a long line of deities , nothing unique ultimately . Rom 1:22-23.
The Bible prophets and apostles warn about false prophets . Jesus Himself took the time to remind his followers that in the latter days men would arise claiming to be His messengers , prophets . He had His apostles remind their flock about such impostors and how to detect them ( Gal :8 ; 2Tim 4:3,4 ; 2 Cor 11:4-15 ; 2Jn 7-9 ) , and we have this information today to use to test latter days prophets . Mormon prophets have failed the test . Being well dressed and living a moral lifestyle
can not make up for teaching false doctrine about God . It’s that simple . Continuing to follow and submit to men who have drifted from the truth about God has consequences — Isa 9:16 ; 2Tim 4:3, 4 .
May the Mormon people test their prophets , because decent sincere people can be fooled by men claiming to be appointed by Jesus to preach . May the Mormon people walk away from the prophets and walk into the freedom that God has waiting for all those who discover how unique He is and desire to know Him personally by the way He has willed — Jn 14:6 ; Jn 17: 3 .
For some reason I’m not getting the audio but like I told Sharon, since one of my many careers was teaching the deaf and hard-of-hearing, I just read John MacArthur’s lips. Then to double check the audio on my computer I went out to YouTube and listened to the Beach Boys album “All Summer Long”. It helps me get through the cold snap we are now having.
Anyway, as I’ve said on another post, I don’t know why Joseph Smith and the rest of these pitiful prophets even get a listen from anyone. Smith said that God appointed him to restore Christianity. Does anyone know what that restored gospel was when Smith first came on the scene? What Smith did was have a slow roll-out of this supposed restored gospel. A couple of the things that Smith promoted was the deification of men who would practice the “principle” of polygamy.
Does anyone believe seriously that first century Christians believed in many gods, men becoming gods and the practice of polygamy? Would any LDS member provide me with any historical data/information to support this notion?
Joseph Smith got so full of himself that any idea that passed through his mind became a message from God. It is known that Smith had an adultery problem and used his position in his church to seduce women and justify it on spiritual grounds.
Joseph Smith had no idea who God is.
This time of year it’s easy to see how the public could accept Mormonism as just another Christian church in the neighborhood , the Holiday festivities , singing , plays , and profession grade presentations on it’s web site give the public little chance at seeing the Mormon church as anything other than a Bible believing Christian church which preaches the gospel of Jesus Christ . Mormon leaders have honed this image and it has paid off in successful proselytizing especially the last several decades . However , when one takes the time to carefully examine Mormonism beyond the public interviews and what it’s smiling Missionaries share then a more complete picture emerges .
While claiming to worship the same Creator God which is found in the Bible’s pages , in point of fact that is only a half truth . Mormon leaders have called their God by the same names /titles that are found in the Bible , but in looking further into what Mormon leaders have taught reveals some very interesting , and unfortunate , things . In desiring to become a God Joseph Smith had to lower God in order to sell his new belief , so he claimed that everyone had been wrong about God for a long long time . The real truth about God , according to Smith’s ” new light” was that He was a man (from another planet )who had become the Creator , He was not always God . That made the position and level which our Creator attained within reach of Smith and all those males who accepted his teaching and worked hard obeying the rules, laws , in his new church .
It made this egregious teaching seem ” reasonable ” to LDS . Sadly , people are detoured by men , latter days prophets , into believing doctrines that the Bible simply does not teach . Such men are false prophets , no matter how “wholesome ” of an appearance they may have .
It was this male God and a Goddess from another world who sired LDS and all mankind as spirit children in heaven first , then they were sent to this earth to be born as mortals . Jesus’ birth at Bethlehem was the result of this male God coming down to earth and sleeping with Mary to provide a body for him to live among the rest of mankind and be the Savior . But that Mormon teaching is only for the spiritually mature LDS to understand , supposedly . One thing’s for sure we will never see it explained in the many Christmas Holiday festivities the Mormon church produces , because that would greatly hinder it’s proselytizing .
the Mormon people deserve to know the truth about what their leaders have been up to — their distortions about God . Because life’s to short to keep following latter days false prophets .
Mike,
The life style of the Mormon people is a great asset in selling the (Mormon) LDS sect. They project an image of being devout, sincere, dedicated, morally clean people with great families. What people don’t see is the pressure that many within this sect feel to perform at a very high level. I’m all for performance but too often what these folks are left with is the burning question, “Have I done enough?”.
This “doing enough” is imposed on them from the top by a hierarchy that needs high performers to buy into the fable of becoming a god. Not only do those dedicated to the idea of becoming a god have to be morally on target, but also (they need) to participate in temple rituals that they believe will provide them the desired out-come; personal deification.
I might ask a Mormon who is reading this, “Did Joseph Smith do enough?” After all he taught that if someone were to reach the highest level of the Celestial Kingdom, they had to practice the “principle”, plural marriage. The wife count is at some where around thirty-three women for Smith. I don’t know exactly the number for Brigham Young but it exceeded Joseph Smith. No telling how many wives Smith would have procured if his life hadn’t been cut short.
Finally, did Joseph Smith do enough to destroy traditional orthodox Christian belief of those who follow him even to this day? The end result of Smiths doctrine of God is that there are millions if not billions of gods in the universe, all former men who, by maintaining loyalty to the “one true church” system, could also become gods.
Is this what the apostles taught? It’s not that difficult to find out exactly what Jesus’ early disciples believed about God. It wasn’t “lost” as Smith claimed. The Father sent the Holy Spirit on the Day of Pentecost to the Church Christ had established. The message of the Gospel of Jesus Christ has been kept secure by the guidance of the Spirit.
It’s there to be found if the Mormon people would open up their hearts to what God has provided for them through Christ Jesus Our Lord.
Was what the apostles knew and taught about the nature of God and the gift of salvation lost (after the apostles died)? Was it necessary to have a “modern day prophet” reveal the “lost gospel”?
First of all, a modern day Mormon needs to know that Joseph Smith didn’t start out with these notions of many gods and men becoming gods.
If I were a Mormon, the first question I’d ask is, “What was Joseph Smith’s original revelation about God?” Then I would ask, “Do we know what the apostles of Jesus taught about God and His plan of salvation?” These things are knowable. They aren’t shrouded in mystery. We have a written record. There wasn’t a giant conspiracy that resulted in the first century Christian gospel being lost.
The Bible tells us plainly that “In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God.” There’s no mistaking who Jesus is. There is no mistaking that God’s attributes have been proclaimed.
The Mormon gods are limited in their abilities. Not only are there a lot of gods in Mormonism, but they are a pretty pathetic bunch. The Bible clearly teaches that there is one God and He will not have any other Gods before Him. The “gods” that people have placed before God, are gods of their own imagination and concoction.
Falcon,
The bottom line is that people need to compare what any of the many prophets around today are claiming and teaching with what Jesus’ apostles taught in their travels as they preached far and wide .
For those like Mormons , who do follow men who claim to be prophets , it is critical that they test them and not be content to accept them as true prophets because of their appearance and smiles .
False prophets can be well meaning individuals , act polite , and even talk about “following Christ ” .
It’s easy to be fooled into thinking these prophets are truly sent by God . Mormons have been fooled,
and that breaks our hearts . Anyone can be misled by false prophets , and Paul reminded Timothy
to anchor his beliefs in the Word of God to avoid wandering away into doctrines that were not sound
this is sound counsel and our safety today is greatly protected by following it . But sadly, people are detoured by men who come claiming to be prophets sent by God , or claiming to be the modern day counterparts of Jesus’ apostles like Paul, John etc and with polished presentations at the door or in pubic venues they convince people to join them .
Joseph Smith , and the men who succeeded him to run the Mormon church , swerved from sound doctrine and many followed them . Mormonism is not the very same church Jesus established 2000
years ago through His apostles , now ” restored ” . The Mormon ” restored gospel ” is likewise a good counterfeit of the true one preached by Paul . For Paul it was the great truth about the Lord God that Isaiah proclaimed before Him — One True Lord God , and to which Christians embrace still today as the incomparable Creator :
– Isa 40:18 = No other ” god” can be likened to the One True God . But the latter day prophets of Mormonism teach that there are plenty of Gods who are just like the God who Isaiah proclaimed,
In Mormonism the God who Isaiah worships was sired by another God. There’s even grandfather type Gods who qualify as equal to Isaiah’s God as well . But Mormons have to downplay some Gods there’s so many in existence in the heavens so Mormon leaders believe that only three of them are the ones to emphasis here in this life .
– Isa 44:8 = there is no other God beside the One True God . But the latter days prophets of Mormonism have taught that there is a God beside Him , two other separate Gods, one His father and the other His brother — three separate Deities in a ruling Council . Christians , like Paul ,knew of no ” Gods “, for him it was one God , not three Gods , and Christians today still believe in only one
God , not Gods (with female deities ) .
– Isa 46: 5 = there is no other deity equal to Isaiah’s God , He alone is unique , INCOMPARABLE.
He is greater than any other person, or thing we could compare Him to — He is that
unique of a God according to the Bible . But the latter days prophets of Mormonism
made Him something He is not , because they have taught He has a God above Him
one who has more dominion than He and who even fathered Him through sex with a
Goddess wife . Being born into a heavenly home He had to be taught along with many
others how to become a God , and He eventually learned enough to be worthy to be
named Jehovah God , and was then finally able to do mighty acts but this ability took
time to attain .
This is the God that the latter days prophets of Mormonism have introduced to their flock and the world . People who anchor their faith in the God revealed in the Bible ( and Book of Mormon ) know no such Deity , because such a God does not exist . Like other false prophets in these latter days Mormon leaders have created their teachings about God by following their feelings , not by listening to God , and sadly many decent people follow them — and that can end in spiritual disaster .
Mormonism is not the answer .
Isa .
Yes, Mormonism is not the answer! Happy New Year to all here. I certainly agree with Dr. Macarthur’s conclusion, and it’s Scripturally based. I wouldn’t say I agree with all his teachings, but on this topic, he’s bang on.
Happy New Year all!
I pray God continues to use this forum to address serious issues with Mormonism and bring Mormons to Him!
Thank you, MJP. I will join you in that prayer! Many thanks to all of you for making Mormon Coffee a safe and hospitable place to address the hard questions while seeking answers from God’s Word. May you all have a blessed 2015!
God bless you Sharon, your family , and the other MRM staff and their families . Your labor of love to the precious Mormon people to know the true Jesus and His saving grace .
To all my brothers and sister in Christ who post here and minister to the Mormon people , may 2015
be a blessed year for you and your families .
As the minutes tick-tick away another year, the falcon is hold-up in his house with his trusty and loyal canine friends watching an Elvis documentary on TCM. I especially like it when Elvis sings harmony on gospel songs with his back up singers.
There’s something about the truth that is told in those old time tunes; proclaiming the truth of the gospel of Jesus Christ. My prayer for the coming year is that those of us who are posting here and those at MRM will be anointed by the Spirit of God to bring the Good News to those Mormons who may stop by here.
So Happy New Year to all of my MC friends. I consider us all a part of a very special family.
The Lord is God There is no other. In deutoronomy chapter 4 verse 35 it further states You were shown to know that the Lord is God There is none else besides him. Then in verse 39 Know today and take unto your heart that the Lord is God in the heavens above and the earth below There is none else
I think this passage suggests implies a form of unity that curiously mormons even with their separate gods seem to have better understanding than most christians. It appears that mormons believe that separate persons can leave their ego and be of one mind and one soul unified as a chorus in tune as One God. (even though physically appear separated)
What if nothing physical really exists and as scripture indicates there really is nothing else besides god. That non existence would include you and me and that everything we perceive about ourselves and reality does not really exist outside of God. I think this concept explains some of teachings of jesus and paul.
I think when LDS church rejects its unique doctrine and orients itself along your type of christian thinking that it may placing itself and its members on a longer more painful path.
From reading your post I am informed that there are other forces other than god such as Mormonism Satan and even yourself. And that forces other than god be it satan be individual ignorance and personal selfishness act as outside forces that cause people to believe certain things and behave in certain ways that are not in accord with Gods will. You see yourself in a fallen world You divide God You divide yourself from Jews Mormons and other christians who dont interpret 2000 year old translated writings in the exact same way. But the most troubling thing is that you set you believe you are apart and separated from God.
And all I can say to you is that we are not separate from God and that his will is manafest and that there truly is none besides God
So…..mi2
I did my best to follow your thinking but I must admit your post left me confused. Is that the point?
Let me get to your summary sentence. You wrote, “…..we are not separate from God…”. What exactly do you mean by that? I get the rest; “….there truly is none besides God.” Yes, God is unique. We can share his character but not his nature.
Let me just give you a couple of verses from Ephesians 6.
10 Finally, be strong in the Lord and in the strength of his might. 11 Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the schemes of the devil. 12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the cosmic powers over this present darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly places. 13 Therefore take up the whole armor of God, that you may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand firm. 14 Stand therefore, having fastened on the belt of truth, and having put on the breastplate of righteousness, 15 and, as shoes for your feet, having put on the readiness given by the gospel of peace. 16 In all circumstances take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming darts of the evil one; 17 and take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God, 18 praying at all times in the Spirit, with all prayer and supplication. To that end keep alert with all perseverance, making supplication for all the saints, 19 and also for me, that words may be given to me in opening my mouth boldly to proclaim the mystery of the gospel, 20 for which I am an ambassador in chains, that I may declare it boldly, as I ought to speak.
So if you don’t accept the Bible as the authoritative Word of God, none of this will make any sense to you. The starting point to understanding God’s revelation to mankind is to trust that He has the where-with-all to express His will through the prophets.
If not, you’re on your own devising your own religion.
The starting point is the acceptance of the God of Israel with an understanding that there is there is none else besides God
Why not be a sparrow instead of Falcon I love all birds however and i know God created birds if prey for a good purpose. But I have hard time with Falcons and i chase them away from the bird feeder least they eat one of the many songbirds at least 50 species that eat at my bird feeder. It was hard to watch wednesday when
I tried to free small chickadee screaming as it
was about to be eaten by one of those birds of prey. I have taken protective measures to keep Falcons from eating the songbirds that visit me. I wonder why someone would want to be such a beast.
The path that no bird of prey knoweth neither hath the Falcons eye seen it. The ancient hebrews had no word for falcon. The only falcon sized birds in. ancient Israel are similar to our american kestral and not known for their great vision as they kill by ambushing small song birds. (like they do at my bird feeder) The type and most common bird of prey the hebrew writer were refering to was vulture (an eagle would be remote possiblity also less common) as larger birds of prey are know to have excellent vision. I not sure you want to be named vulture though because you are wanting to fight and go for the kill not retreive something thats already dead. The christian falcon is kind of similar to book of mormon horse. The problem is even the best translations have errors. The book is best understood in terms of the culture of people that wrote it. And in this case a little bit of knowlege of birding helps. I think in some cases word at least in any other language except hebrew aramaic or possibly greek can itself become graven image. Serving the god of Israel involves more than interpration of written word but a change of heart from deception toward the good of what is true which leads you toward the creator.
I agree God is unique because he only truly exists. God so encompasses everything that I am not certain that he can be divided into different paets. In your previous response you indicates that god could share his character but not his nature. This kind of implies that god has at least two parts a nature part that according to you cannot be shares
and a character part which could be shared
according to you. How does this make you different than LDS. who have a divided GODs personhood. Is it OK to divide god’s attributes but not his persons. Even though I dont view creeds or even the written word at least in English quite the same way you do. I try and understamd the meaning behind the writing. And after thinking about the creeds I can see now see the good of the truth in them. God cannot be divided into parts God and is present everywhere. I see the truth in those statements. FYI although I beieve God cannot be split into parts and will reveal and share all of himslf with us. This total union of heave and earth is implied in the name Israel. I am imperfect now as I am behind a dark glass and see myself as seaprate from God and only see in part. But that which is perfect is come (perfect not meaning without error but whole) I will come to understand my true relationship with God. I believe God is calling us out of Jacob and after we struggle with our separate idenity and sin
and find it out heart to let God rule over us and we can become Isreal and be a prince rule with God dwelling in us. This is the change in the heart and in ones perception and the victory of love over knowledge. This is what Paul is talking about.