Open offer to GB (Vance Bowler)

Since GB has (at least privately) indicated that he thinks MC is not truly intent on exposing actual truth and for allowing frank, open, substantive discussion over important issues, I would like to publicly invite him to a recorded, audible Skype conversation where he can have direct, live access to me, and ask immediate, frank questions.

GB has indicated that he believes I may unfairly edit the conversation, but I can assure him that I won’t edit the recorded conversation at all. In fact, I invite other Mormons to sit in on the conversation with us over Skype and record the conversation as well, so everyone has an immediate copy of the raw audio.

If you would like to take me up on my offer, GB, please e-mail me at [email protected]. Instead of repeating complaints, why not take such opportunities for putting a spotlight on what you think is the truth? I extend this offer not only to GB, but to any Mormon here who thinks they’re having trouble engaging in an open, meaningful, substantive conversation. My username on Skype is aaronshaf.

Note: This thread is simply an offer to GB (and any others). The comments are open for acceptance or rejection. Non-substantive comments that steer down the road of personal attacks and yet more complaining will simply be deleted.

Grace and peace,


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6 Responses to Open offer to GB (Vance Bowler)

  1. I just deleted a comment (by an evangelical). To be fair, this thread is not for complaining about the complaining of others either. It’s simply either for acceptance of rejection of the offer.

    I know GB has seen this post. He has e-mailed me since I e-mailed the link to him, but I still hasn’t accepted.

  2. Rick B says:

    I hope the LDS take you up on the Offer, this way they cannot keep saying, You or us Christians are lying and not quoting verses in an accurate manner.

    I have one question. What Is Skype and how can I listen in if people take you up on the offer, I know next to nothing about computers, and my skills on a computer are less than basic. Rick b

  3. Skype (which you can get at is like AIM or Google Talk or Yahoo Messenger, but it’s particularly good at video and audio chat.

    It’s limited to I think 4 or 5 persons at a time, so I could “call” you so you could listen in while I converse with another.

  4. Berean says:

    I look forward to hearing the conversation if possible. I hope if we aren’t able to hear it live that there can be a clip featured on here later.

    This kind of echoes some of the comments made on another blog thread about the leadership of the Mormon Church not directly engaging those on the other side of aisle. I can’t even get local Mormon leadership to discuss anything. A High Council Member promised me that he would answer all my questions when I presented myself at the ward for a Sunday school class. I asked the first question from the book of Alma and he just threw his hands up in the air and then said nothing. After a brief pause he just looked at me and said, “Do you like to eat?” I never heard from him again.

    The closest I have come to having the opportunity to speak with a member of the Quorum of the Twelve is with Mormon Apostle Jeffery Holland. His son lives here where I do. He is a ward bishop. One of my former students is his next door neighbor and Apostle Holland is down here for visits somewhat frequently. Neither one of them won’t even engage in a conversation standing out in the yard much less our asking if we could come by his ward to attend a class. They have refused offers to come over for a get-together. Holland gave a talk at last conference to the world, but won’t engage in conversation with two people next door? What’s there to be afraid of?

    Aaron, I think this is great. I hope that it can come together. Would it be appropriate to say:

    “Speak now or forever hold your peace?”

  5. SteveH says:


    I can certainly understand and sympathize with the frustration expressed by GB regarding the stifling of debate on Mormon Coffee. I have always enjoyed GB’s insightful comments.

    While I enjoy engaging in an open, meaningful and substantive conversation on all matters LDS, however all too often the debate sinks into polemic accusations. This is a shame as I believe a forum such as Mormon Coffee can serve some good as long as people are willing to be respectful of others.

    I for one am willing to engage in a discussion as you proposed.

  6. SteveH, not to be picky, but in my understanding, debate by definition involves (at least implicitly) polemical accusations, i.e. “you’re wrong about this, and here is why, and this instead is the truth.” In that sense I don’t have any problem with polemics. But inasmuch as polemics involve something that distracts from the heart and soul and substance of the issues, I would likewise use the “sinking” verb.

    Please give me a “ring” on Skype. I am “aaronshaf”. Hopefully we can model for people good, hearty conversation about important topics.

    Grace and peace,


    PS Steve, please consider coming to the next Tabletalk in the Salt Lake area.

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